Visit Digits's column >>

DIGITSHome Page

Living Samsara
Add To Watchlist
Articles Posted: 40; Links Seeded: 231
Member Since: 5/2006Last Seen: 10/29/2009

Acceptance is the Answer

advertisement

Acceptance saved my life.

So it is with much fanfare and vigor, that I would read RebelGirl's recent article entitled "Acceptance...." I would tell you about it but it would detract from the simplicity of her message. I would invite you to read her short yet powerful article only if you are a member of the empathetic, compassionate, and loving species of the human race. The rest of you, unfortunately, may not understand. And this is where my article comes in.

I am a recovering alcoholic. I am also a recovering self-mutilator and anorexic. I believe, rather than classifying myself as one formerly "messed up" kid, I could safely say that all of my "isms" - these external symptoms of my internal chaos, also known as "i, self, and me" - were results of my being controlled, feelings of being controlled, or feelings of lack of control. Or to make a larger and more sufficient umbrella, that would capture the more complete picture, let me say, "Symptoms of Codependency."

Codependency is not necessarily the needy and clingy person who needs to have a relationship to suit her - though that could be one manifestation. No, codependency is, by simple definition, that act in which we give up [or never felt as if we had] autonomy over our own selves or lives or in which we place autonomy of our lives into the hands of another person - whether it's a parent, a sibling, a romantic partner, or even a child. [See my offsite article "What is Codependency?" for more information and examples.]

Acceptance is the Answer to Codependency

Let me say it was the answer to *my* codependency. And if this baffles you, I am here to hopefully clear that up. I was baffled too! "You mean I have to have to accept that people will control me?" Oh no. See. This is where it bit me in the butt. I thought that when I heard people say, "I have to accept it." that that is what they meant. No. Not even a little bitty bit.

No. What I had to accept is that these people who tried to control me or who controlled me were going to keep on controlling me or trying to, despite my alcoholism or recovery from alcoholism. They were going to continue trying to control me even if I got down to 90 pounds. They were going to continue trying to control me even if they witnessed the knife marks on my wrists. That with my not having a developed voice at the time, the only way I could exhibit my pain was to hurt myself. I had never developed the ability to simply say, "No more.'

So acceptance came in when I discovered I had a part I needed to play. My part, if I were to live happy, joyous, and free, was to accept I was deficient in some tools. [Note that I did not say, "I had to accept I was deficient as a person."] Once I accepted that I wanted to recover from self-harm, I had to accept that to stay that way, I had to accept I did not have the answers already. Once I accepted I did not have the tools, I could work on achieving them. [As evidenced already, my answers took the form of hurting myself and that surely wasn't working was it?]

Are you the Controlled Person or the Controlling Person?

Codependency manifests one of two ways. Believe it or not, the controlled person who lacks healthy tools and resources to take care of herself is *just* as "codependent" as the controlling person who lacks healthy tools and resources to take care of herself. Oh yes! It's a mind blower isn't it? :-)

The person, then, who has been the thorn in your side for many many years...Would you believe it if I told you that she was once the controlled? Think about that for a few minutes and it makes perfect sense. She was either controlled by maybe someone else's alcoholism [and vowed it would never happen again] or she was perhaps controlled by a parent's mental or emotional illness and though that in order to combat it she needed to be *more in control* of her environment or maybe she was even controlled by a spouse's abusive fists or words and figured that for that to never happen again, she would simply be more diligent in controlling others around her.

The good news for this sort of codependent is that they, too, can recover. The bad news for this sort of codependent [or even worse for the others around them] is that as long as there is a controllable person around, they rarely do because they have yet to reach their own personal bottom in finally realizing they cannot control other people into providing them happiness or serenity. But once they have finally gained a level of acceptance in knowing that their tools of control fail to actually control their environment, and their misery has reached an all-time low, there is a solution.

Many types of these sorts of codies can be found in your local Al-Anon meetings. These people in one way or another have been affected by another person's alcoholism and only in finally getting miserable enough in realizing they cannot win against this disease, they go into Al-Anon as a broken shell of a person. This is good news for them because they now have an opportunity to learn how to finally get to real peace and serenity.

Other support systems for Codependent Recovery include NarAnon, CoDA, and ACoA and it matters little which sort of "control" you fall under; the controlled or the controller. At any time, I have found that I waffle between the two although my primary problem was being "the controlled."

Lack of power! This was our dilemma!

Acceptance gives us Power

By accepting our shortcomings, our frailties, or where we're falling short, we can find a remedy. In this, is where our power is. As long as we remain in denial and non-acceptance we continue trying to fix, manage, and control ourselves or our environment in order for us or it to somehow remain "safe." And while doing so, notice we have anger, rage, sadness, fear, dis-contentedness, and chaos.

I certainly was not happy cutting myself. I was also not happy starving. I was definitely not happy needing to drink every day. But somewhere deep in the back of my mind, I mistakenly thought if I could act out enough or take up less space or do what was asked during the day while numbing myself up at night, that the world would finally ignore me and leave me alone; that it would quit trying to control me. This is my truth and I accept that.

So that when my personal first step was to stop drinking, it took a lot of work but I was finally able to stay stopped while at the same time being happy in my own skin. It did not take long, however, for me to discover and remember why I turned to alcohol in the first place; the world was still here and it still tried to dominate me.

I kid you not. My first week in a 12 step recovery group and two women in succession over a two day period approached me with "You're too skinny. You need to gain weight." So let this please be a lesson to members of 12 step recovery groups; "Mind your own business. When anyone's weight - or anything else - becomes your business, I am sure they will let you know." Not to mention, anyone who says anything close to this has just revealed to me they are "controllers." In the case of the two women who said this to me, their personal failings of controlling their environment were manifested in their obesity. [Yes. They eat out of a lack of control.]

Before I sought recovery for my "being controlled" issues, I needed something before then as it was increasingly clear that there were some folks in these 12 step meetings who had their own controlling issues. Fortunately I met a friend who had 25 yrs sobriety and suggested a book: "When I Say No I Feel Guilty" by Manuel J. Smith. To this day, I think that by reading that book, and being willing to try the suggestions in it, I stayed sober. And after a year of sobriety is when I would seek a 12 step Codependency-flavored group.

Self-Acceptance & Other-Acceptance

Acceptance is key. But not the kind of acceptance that necessarily means "agree with." Rather, the kind of acceptance that means "to acknowledge."

The kind of acceptance that freed me from bondage was the acceptance that is the opposite of denial; absolutely not the kind of acceptance that said, "Once you agree with people bulldozing you then you will be happy." The kind of acceptance that said, "Yes. This person bulldozes you. No you do not have the tools to deal with it. Now what?" Once again. Please do not confuse this with accepting the unacceptable.

Often I've heard people say, "Accept it" in the face of their doing something unacceptable. These are those controlling people we've seen. When I hear that, today, in my mind I say, "Okay. I will." Then I take proper and healthy steps to insure I do not have to "agree with it". In this, I can set a boundary, remove my geographical location, use my voice, or even detach. So I'm not telling them I agree with their behavior and will sit by and be a passive participant again. I am rather saying, I acknowledge this is who you choose to be and now I will take proper steps to secure myself. And that's how acceptance is liberating.

Acceptance is the Answer

Acceptance in the answer to every problem. It needs to be. If I do not accept, first there is even a problem, how can I seek a solution? Sometimes I need to accept my own limitations. And maybe other times I need to accept another person's limitations. In all cases I find myself upset or distraught based on external influences, if I can search for the "acceptance" I need to apply, I am almost assuredly guaranteed to begin the steps for finding a solution.

 

My Related Newsvine Articles of Potential Benefit

  • How to Help an Alcoholic Stop Drinking
  • A Relative's Alcoholic Drinking - A Memoir
  • Rumors, Gossip, and the Truth
  • Sometimes the Kindest Word is No
  • Cult-Control, Kids, and Straight, Inc.
  • Images and Text, Copyright © 2008, Digits. Creative Commons. Share with Credit.

    • 19 Votes
    • Enjoy this article? Help vote it up the 'Vine.

    Back To Top

    What's this?
    Who's leading the conversation?
    This visualization below allows you to see the impact that each user has on the current conversation. The top row contains the group of users who have had the most impact, the 2nd row the group of users who have had the 2nd most impact (et cetera). Users with similar impact are grouped together, and the average score of the group is shown to the left of the group. The author of the article is also shown on the left, in their corresponding group. Each user's score is based on the number of comments the user has made plus the number of votes their comments have received. The scores are calculated relative one another, so while their absolute value is not particularly important, their relative difference does indicate a larger difference in impact on the conversation.
    57
    12
    5.0
    {"commentId":1708230,"authorDomain":"RebelGirl"}

    Wow! This is amazing! Thank you sooo much, I think mine is just a glimmer of hope in regards to yours! Thanks Digits! You Rock SISTA!!

    Have you read "Co-Dependent No More" by Melody Beattie?? Amazing stuff huh?

    {"commentId":1708230,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"RebelGirl"}
    • 4 votes
    Reply#1 - Fri Apr 18, 2008 3:42 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1708841,"authorDomain":"digits"}
    Have you read "Co-Dependent No More" by Melody Beattie?? Amazing stuff huh?

    Oh of course! And also, "Beyond Codependency" is a good one as well as her weekly meditation book. I don't believe in making gurus out of mere mortals because we ALL have some light inside of us that's equally as bright...but in her case, I do advocate people learning from her. She's been directly to hell and has come out on the other side. Like me. Like Fugi. [Below] and like you, too, I imagine.

    I don't learn from the saints. I learn from the sinners; the flawed. They're the ones I believe God uses. I am sure God can use the *perfect* people, too, of course... I could never relate to them.

    It's amazing how a little health from one person can really spread to others around us. Kind of like *dis-ease* but in the opposite direction. :)

    I think mine is just a glimmer of hope in regards to yours!

    Don't knock yourself. Yours is brilliant in its own right.

    {"commentId":1708841,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 4 votes
    #1.1 - Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:50 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1708260,"authorDomain":"fugitive247"}

    Fantastique, dear Digits! Sis, your candor and eloquence never fails to astound. ♥

    {"commentId":1708260,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"fugitive247"}
    • 5 votes
    Reply#2 - Fri Apr 18, 2008 3:51 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1708845,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    It took a day. My brain. Befuddled and going crazy ADD. All over here and oops - some over there too. I work within my parameters anyway. And thank you dahlink!

    {"commentId":1708845,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 4 votes
    #2.1 - Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:51 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1708386,"authorDomain":"abcrow"}

    Digits you are an inspiration. Thank you for the article.

    I have a sister in law who has OCD and struggles with control issues. Her son who is 10 is now showing OCD tendencies (multiple showers each day, reading 300 page novels daily, obsessive cleaning, things like that). What are your thoughts on breaking the control cycle?

    {"commentId":1708386,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"abcrow"}
    • 5 votes
    Reply#3 - Fri Apr 18, 2008 4:23 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1708880,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    And I thank you for your compliment. I would be glad to offer my thoughts and just wanted you to know I did not overlook you. We're about to walk out the door but it will also give me an opportunity to think and feel a little more in-depth over this. Because although I understand the sense of comfort in the OCD behaviors, I am not familiar with "OCD" as a seemingly stand-a-lone dis-ease. [The Jack Nicholson, As Good as it Gets, character for example.]

    The people I usually work with have OCD as some side effect of trauma or even abuse that eases when the root issue is dealt with.

    But I'll offer some more thoughts when I have time.

    {"commentId":1708880,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 3 votes
    #3.1 - Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:05 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1712652,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    Here, Ann said here:

    I have a sister in law who has OCD and struggles with control issues. Her son who is 10 is now showing OCD tendencies (multiple showers each day, reading 300 page novels daily, obsessive cleaning, things like that). What are your thoughts on breaking the control cycle?

    I'm glad I took some time away from this. The day I wrote this was aleady a haphazerd day for my own mental processes and your question - as we're leaving - made my brain buzz. But with some time it turns out I *can* share some thoughts. One particular experience of mine...

    After not drinking for a while, I began noticing other characteristics I figured I could conquer. I would just apply the same steps. It worked for my alcoholic compulsion...why not?

    Well. It wasn't so easy because I'd engaged this particular ritual weekly, daily, hourly and sometimes for several minutes at the time on any given stressful or mindless hour and it'd been going on since I was around 12 or 13. [And funny enough I got it from my Mom too. However mine went quite severe.] I mentioned self-mutilation and this is a version of it although I never realized it at the time...Mouth biting. Infliction of pain.

    Dentist visits always revealed curiousity from the hygeinist and so forth. Even a picture or a video of me with my finger pushed into my cheek and gnawing looking ridiculous served no kind of deterrent. Girls making fun of me in the 7th grade for it, no deterrent. Admonishments and getting yelled at didn't stop it. [For a lovely karmic repercussion, however, the same 3 or 4 hoodlums who used to make fun of me in the 7th grade... I witnessed THEIR mindless mouth biting in High School. See karma run.]

    So a decade and a half later after tired of sometimes drawing blood, and VERY tired of the inside of my mouth feeling like grounded meat, and now being sober and with a mind clearing out, I was just sick of it. I'd tried putting bitters on the inside of my mouth [nail anti-bite], the whole wrist snapping with a rubber band...I even asked my adult friends [when I was adult] to hold me accountable and remind me. Nothing.

    Finally. Knowing what I was discovering about my 12 step recovery process and how it could keep me recovered from drinking alcohol or taking any mind-altering substance in ANY form, I guess it was about a year and a couple months sibriety when it occurred to me I could apply the SAME principles to my mouth. [Oh yeah. I thought it was funny.]

    But God apparently didn't.

    Here is precisely what happened. And though I am sure the specificity doesn't matter, I can only share what DID work for me and so I do not want to leave anything out in case it could work for maybe your sister or your nephew...or YOU - or anyone reading this - for that matter if you have a harmful habit or compulsion...

    I went to a 12 step type of meeting as usual. After about three days of obsessing about finally trying to STOP biting my mouth and just sick of the whole thing...the topic came up about "our isms" and *alcohol* being a symptom only. How it can manifest in other destructive ways. Because this was a women's meeting, I remember a lot of women jokingly bringing up their chocolate addiction [which is not funny to me because sugar *IS* an addiction for some people]. I remember feeling angry at their frivolity when I was in real live pain with something OTHER than alcohol that I really DID want a solution for.

    So I shared - and at this point I was still a very shy insecure person so for me to open my mouth in a meeting was a feat! I spoke angrily. I said something to the effect, "So if this freaking GOD can take away my desire and creving to stop drinking, what the hell is going on with my biting my mouth? Why the hell is nothing going on there?"

    Later that night - after the meeting - it would occur to me I'd not ASKED for the obsession to be removed. [Like I HAD done with alcohol.] Yes, this is leading to something so childlike and simple... So I said, "What the hey. Let's see what happens." I prayed. A very simple prayer that sounded like all my others when I was ready for God to intervene [or for a manifesation to occur...whichever terminology suits you best]... Something like

    ...i am powerless over my mouth biting. i have tried everything. i can NOT do it. i can NOT stop it and i NEED it to stop. i need YOUR help for it to stop. why you would relieve me of the obsession to drink and not this...so i figure you could...and you will have to because i cannot do it. please help me. amen....

    i DO remember, because it'd been such an emotional day that [and like many of my prayers that would yield results] i had forgotten I'd done it. so it was about the third day. ...and i remember the third day specifically because for me, my magic number's always been three. three hours, three days, three weeks, or three months for a change to ensue. this is not in concrete; just a pattern i have noticed over the years...

    so day three i was at the computer doing work when my tongue glided over the side of my mouth. it felt smoother. in that instant i realized i did not have the obsession nor the compulsion to bite. i also then [2nd thought] realized i'd not bitten for three days! [i cannot be sure when my last bite really was...after the meeting, before the meeting or after the prayer or even the next day? i don't know because i did it mindlessly...but i did remember that to say three days felt about right as did the coinciding smoothness on my cheek.]

    that was it. that was in early part of 2004.

    i know this is a lot of text for a rather simple message but to say, "i prayed" sounds rather naive and i doubt people really believe that. but I believe that in telling of my precise experience and leaving it up to the reader to try to glean what the *magic* was...then maybe they can extrapolate *that magic* and apply it into their situation.

    There is one critical component though, that cannot be underestimated in my opinion. The prayer. The petitioning. It has to be honest. And whether one believes in God, is little matter. Whether it's *magic* and we simply "speak the words" and bear the fruit or whether it's some bearded invisible guy in the sky with a wand...or whether it's our subconscious breaking free from our ego's bondage...that's a personal philosophy. [I call it all God.] BUT...the one common idea that has never failed me has been the prayer and petitioning of precisely what it is I need or want and the raw honesty in going about asking for it.

    I have an offsite article [part 4] that may explain that part better. [Here is another one on Manifesting Reality.]

    Again, I apologize for the wordiness but do hope it can be of some benefit in some fashion. I do understand what it's like to be a slave to behaviors...or in bondage...both phrases being equally debilitating in their true sentiment.

    Namaste.
    I wish you, your sister, and nephew wellness, health, happiness, and peace.

    {"commentId":1712652,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 3 votes
    #3.2 - Sat Apr 19, 2008 11:25 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1721534,"authorDomain":"abcrow"}

    Digits, thank you so much. I plan to read your other articles and digest this information a little more. I know with my sister in law that the need to control things is a major factor with her. What the root cause is, I don't know.

    Some of this need for control has been passed down to my nephew and is surfacing with his OCD. I wonder if he is feeling helpless. He is very small for his age, very intelligent, and very quiet. I don't think he feels that he has a "voice."

    I am glad that rather than throw a prescription at the problem, the family is taking him to a physiciatrist. Ben having OCD is very upsetting for me, but you have definitely given me many reasons to be hopeful, and I thank you.

    ~Ann

    {"commentId":1721534,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"abcrow"}
    • 2 votes
    #3.3 - Tue Apr 22, 2008 3:24 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1723862,"authorDomain":"digits"}
    I don't think he feels that he has a "voice."

    Ann, you hit the nail on the head for many of the manifestations of my problems.

    When I began gaining my voice is precisely when healings began. Being quite and shy and the wallflower I was, was NOT humility. It was humiliation. I had pride in reverse which was just as damaging as excessive pride [ego]. But instead of going around harming others I was well-satisfied harming myself.

    I think your recognizing he has little to no voice is a wonderful realization! This means you can help him! Small things... "How are you feeling?" or "What do you think about this?" or "I value what you think here." Small things that seem insignificant to us [right now] would be a HUGE deal to him I bet!

    [They were to me...when I was in my late 20's! "You mean you want to know my opinion?"]

    Small things like that began teaching me I *was* valuable.

    He sounds so precious and so forlorn. I am so glad you are in his life and that his parents aren't throwing medication at it. If they did that [my personal philosophy] he would not get better. He would revert when his tolerance built up or when he quit the meds. I believe in cases like that we're just putting our dis-ease in a more hidden and secret place; not dealing with it.

    I am also very glad we became Newsvine friends :)

    {"commentId":1723862,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 3 votes
    #3.4 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:09 AM EDT
    {"commentId":1724877,"authorDomain":"abcrow"}

    Me too, Digits :)

    {"commentId":1724877,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"abcrow"}
    • 3 votes
    #3.5 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:11 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1709606,"authorDomain":"fscott"}

    Yet another wonderful article, Digits - thank you.

    {"commentId":1709606,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"fscott"}
    • 3 votes
    Reply#4 - Sat Apr 19, 2008 12:49 AM EDT
    {"commentId":1712503,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    Thank you so much Frank. I am glad you enjoyed it. :)

    {"commentId":1712503,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 3 votes
    #4.1 - Sat Apr 19, 2008 10:39 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1712815,"authorDomain":"DrKnow"}

    My druid friends have a phrase - Perfect Love Perfect Trust

    Perfect love has absolutely no conditions. You love them exactly for what they are, nothing more nothing less.

    Perfect trust - trust them to be just as they are, do not expect more of them than they really will give or do.

    You accept yourself and others just as they are. No expectations, no unrealistic expectations whatsoever.

    {"commentId":1712815,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"DrKnow"}
    • 6 votes
    Reply#5 - Sun Apr 20, 2008 12:26 AM EDT
    {"commentId":1713895,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    That's beautiful. I wish it were in peoples reality more often.

    {"commentId":1713895,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 5 votes
    #5.1 - Sun Apr 20, 2008 12:43 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1714319,"authorDomain":"hamid"}

    Out of the park Digits,

    Inspiring indeed. I love your defining of acceptance, which is too often misconceived. Acceptance is not agreement, it is acknowledgment. Brilliant! Thank You...

    {"commentId":1714319,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"hamid"}
    • 4 votes
    Reply#6 - Sun Apr 20, 2008 3:05 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1723890,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    Hamid! Ahhhh. You caught that!

    Brilliant! Brilliant! Brilliant! Thank YOU!

    I tell you, my friend, when I first went into recovery and [not knowing better] and hearing speak of acceptance being the answer and WITH it *being agreement* I was such a wreck, I was WILLING to entertain the thought that it was my fault I got stolen from and was deserving of my verbal abuse...and deserving of getting terrorized from my ex and physically assaulted and...every other horrid memory I had. Yes, I was entertaining that; Trying to get my brain to agree to it!!

    Thank GOD. Thank GOD for my mentor [sponsor] who would come into my life and set my wickedly messed up brain straight! Thank GOD, also for my gravitation toward healthy people. Then, of course, I would begin to think for myself and so today when I hear something that sounds wickedly unhealthy emanating from someone's mouth, I do something very simple.

    I hold it up into the light of my own critical thought, my experience, and my spirit. If two of three of these criteria are fulfilled; If at least two are in AGREEMENT - and one is my SPIRIT - with what has been said, then I accept that statement as healthy and true.

    But like I said...first coming into recovery, being a mental, emotional and spiritual mess, I absorbed what everyone said and tried to make it fit. Thank God for God putting in our path, people who really *do* know what they are talking about! :)

    Thank you for seeing that, my friend. That part of acceptance was critical for me!

    {"commentId":1723890,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 3 votes
    #6.1 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:18 AM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1722188,"authorDomain":"Blueflameleo"}

    Very nice digits i might have to look into obtaining some of theses tools hank you.

    {"commentId":1722188,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"Blueflameleo"}
    • 2 votes
    Reply#7 - Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:03 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1723894,"authorDomain":"digits"}
    Very nice digits i might have to look into obtaining some of theses tools hank you.

    You are welcome. :)

    {"commentId":1723894,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 2 votes
    #7.1 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:19 AM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1728844,"authorDomain":"ronco104"}

    hi digits, luv. do you know of instances where the 'controlled' are controlled bymore than one person, such as two, three or more? being an alcoholic and suffering from ocd, depression, low-self esteem , ect., i tend to be surrounded by people, or is it i i tend to surround myself with people, who are controlling. nearly everyone in my world has a stronger personality than myself. this has been probably THE most significant, and personally disabling aspect of my life. i am always subordinate, or submissive to those around me. it kills me to constantly be shut down or shut out of things, especially to do with family. the two brothers i have mentioned before have done this to me since early kidhood. iot might be helpful to know that out of five kids, these two and me are the only ones to have substance abuse problems. we of course grew out of the late sixties and seventies and took mind expansion to heart. while i am the only one to actually be alcoholic, or at least admit to it, i am the punching bag, so to speak.
    my question is if you deal with others who are controlled not only by family members, but also friends co-workers, hell, you name it. i once had a dog that......

    luv,

    ron

    {"commentId":1728844,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"ronco104"}
    • 2 votes
    Reply#8 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 11:31 AM EDT
    {"commentId":1730363,"authorDomain":"ronco104"}

    i forgot to ask at what point does acceptance becomes resignation? that seems to fit me more at this point in my life. i am just resigned to the fact that those around me are going to control me, or try and there is not a hell of a lot that i can do. at 53 i should be your basic manly type man and stand up for myself, but aftyer this many years, i am just beaten down. i don't want to sound wimpy, though i'm sure i do, but it takes on a life of its own after awhile. its certainly not what i want....

    luv,

    ron

    {"commentId":1730363,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"ronco104"}
    • 2 votes
    Reply#9 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 4:23 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1732347,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    Dear Ron, As to your first question...your first post...

    hi digits, luv. do you know of instances where the 'controlled' are controlled bymore than one person, such as two, three or more? being an alcoholic and suffering from ocd, depression, low-self esteem , ect., i tend to be surrounded by people, or is it i i tend to surround myself with people, who are controlling. nearly everyone in my world has a stronger personality than myself. this has been probably THE most significant, and personally disabling aspect of my life. i am always subordinate, or submissive to those around me.

    Your question: do you know of instances where the 'controlled' are controlled bymore than one person, such as two, three or more?

    My answer: Heck yeah! My own instances.

    I think the controlled are like walking bulls eye targets where every controlling person can sense them out. I really do. And so many people seem to not be happy unless they are controlling, so they look for people who will take it.

    When I began recovering from it, according to a woman I respected a lot, she mentioned that even the way I walked had changed. I walked with my back straight up, shoulders square, making eye contact as I entered a room, and smiling and greeting people openly and warmly. A big difference from when I used to slouch down, look at the floor and try to shuffle by without anyone noticing!

    The GOOD news about being a reformed controllee is we can sense other *controlleds* and reach out to them and try to help THEM.

    But yeah. I've never known a person who was JUST controlled by one person and that was the vacuum it remained in. It's like a built in magnet for other controlling people unless and until the begin the metamorphosis of change. [Via therapy, recovery, practicing, self-help, etc...]

    As to your 2nd question...

    i forgot to ask at what point does acceptance becomes resignation? that seems to fit me more at this point in my life. i am just resigned to the fact that those around me are going to control me, or try and there is not a hell of a lot that i can do. at 53 i should be your basic manly type man and stand up for myself, but aftyer this many years, i am just beaten down. i don't want to sound wimpy, though i'm sure i do, but it takes on a life of its own after awhile. its certainly not what i want....

    Your question: at what point does acceptance becomes resignation?

    My answer: When my fear of change becomes larger than my desire for change so much to the point that I listen to my fear rather than my spirit.

    God allows U-Turns in our life at any time. At 53 even.:) I could wake up tomorrow morning and completely break all of my faulty past agreements and decide to recreate some healthy ones! :) Naturally I would feel fear and naturally I would feel nervous about implementing but that's what I did with MANY situation after I got sober. I seemed to have to. My life depended on it. I did not want to go back to harming myself!

    In those situations, yes I felt fear [absolutely and sometimes petrifyingly so!] but I had one advocate on my side in real life. My AA sponsor. She had faith in me and she had proved to me she would be there for when I hyperventilated. :)

    [...and I remember one time where I did! I called her from the stall of a public bathroom when I'd just initiated a non steam-roll boundary! The person with whom I did this got angry! Oh my! I called my sponsor and she kinda laughed - which soothed me - and said, "So? Let her be angry. It's her anger! Continue to treat her with honor and respect while being happy in the fact you stood up for yourself." :)

    But you see Ron...I was already involved in Codependent recovery at that point so I *knew* not to take anyone's anger personally. But it still SCARED the bejeezus out of me! Hey, I have a phrase you can remember: "What's the worst that can happen? They can't eat you. That would be illegal."

    You are a valuable person Ron and these people and situations are simply your Zen Masters [those who are here or in our lives to *teach* us]. I also believe that when we start changing from one controlling person, it's easier to change from the two and so forth.

    Another phenomenon I have noticed...and this is true or else may I get an awful puncture wound today... I have noticed that when we deal with our intial Zen Masters...that it's as if we've *passed the test*...and that either we've changed so much so that controlling folks are no more attracted to us or WE have gained so much more that we know how to [intuitively?] NOT get enmeshed with controlling people. Either way.

    I was ALWAYS the controlled and always by a certain 'type.' Once I dealt with my source - which happened to be a family member - it became easier to deal with these others or else they disappeared from my life altogether.

    One more thing Ron. Humility is NOT humiliation. HUMILITY is the proper perspective we have on ourselves in relation to the world and God's world. When we think we're the lowly good for nothing's we're operating not from humility but pride...pride in reverse....low self-esteem.

    And God is not in that! So...why had God not *saved* me from *these people?* Why was I still at their whims? Because I had fear and failed to make the effort to change. God gave me the tools and the support of people. But I had fear because I did not trust. SO...with my fear in hand I did it anyway. I started making steps. And you can too.

    I know you can!

    And if you need to hyperventilate to me in a stall in a public bathroom after you've set some amazing boundary, contact me and I'll send you my cell phone number. ;)

    {"commentId":1732347,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 2 votes
    #9.1 - Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:53 AM EDT
    {"commentId":1735202,"authorDomain":"fugitive247"}

    Digits said:

    I think the controlled are like walking bulls eye targets where every controlling person can sense them out. I really do. And so many people seem to not be happy unless they are controlling, so they look for people who will take it.

    No kidding. And boy- don't they raise hell when we get well (or determined) enough to assert ourselves despite their insistence that we're not even capable of doing so much as matching a pair of socks! **sheesh**

    Fear can be a significant stumbling block. For so long many of us have been bullied, blackmailed, and subjected to all manner of emotional guerrilla warfare all to keep us in line with others' expectations of maintaining their perceptions of right living for us. How dare we rock their boat!

    Screw that, man! I'm normally not one for using slogans and 12-step-isms, but these certainly apply...

    • Fear is the opposite of faith.
    • Courage is fear that's said its prayers.

    Awesome discussion, friends! ♥

    {"commentId":1735202,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"fugitive247"}
    • 3 votes
    #9.2 - Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:17 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1736353,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    Thank you sis. I am SO glad you said this! FEAR is a thief isn't it? Um...We think maybe it ought to be classed with stealing!? oh yeah!

    Screw that, man! I'm normally not one for using slogans and 12-step-isms, but these certainly apply...

    • Fear is the opposite of faith.
    • Courage is fear that's said its prayers.

    I love yours best - as I had NEVER heard your two! I really love the second one...it just feels so right and true for me! Courage is fear that's said its prayers. How wonderful and hope-filled!!

    And yes, I absolutely agree with #1 also. I have noticed that when I have fear, I lack faith...Faith that it *will* be alright; Faith that I *will* be alright; Faith that I *will* grow in this; Faith that I *do* have the tools necessarity but that all that's left is for me to implement them... Oh so many ways that can work to shift my subconcious.

    Here are two I remember when God's all but gone out the window and fear seems to be winning and I've all but thrown in the towel on facing my demons... [ie, I am desperate!]

    • F.ace E.verything A.nd R.ecover
    • F.uque E.verything A.nd R.elapse
    • F.uque E.verything A.nd R.un

    {"commentId":1736353,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 3 votes
    #9.3 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:12 AM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1734425,"authorDomain":"ronco104"}

    oy!!! thanks digits, i really feel better. i thank you for all you say. i have not been to an aa meeting in years, or any sort of counseling for that matter. i hate the 'needy' feeling i get, but i do need to hear how others, and you especially have come to grips and have learned to work through yall's situations. being a small town, groups are coming and going and never seem to last long. as for a regular counselor, i can't get indigent health in my county to pay for that. it helps me so much to be reminded of the inner power we have over our lives and our situations. my worst problem is forgetting many of the things you mentioned. i can just feel what you felt with the friend you mentioned. i have been in similar situations, and always i would wind up apologizing for something that was not my fault to begin with. now thats sick.
    you are a wonderful person to take time to help others, digit. thanks so much...i keep telling myself that change is good...thats what they said in rehab, anyway!!!!

    luv,

    ron

    {"commentId":1734425,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"ronco104"}
    • 3 votes
    Reply#10 - Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:36 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1736390,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    oy!!! thanks digits, i really feel better. i thank you for all you say. i have not been to an aa meeting in years, or any sort of counseling for that matter. i hate the 'needy' feeling i get, but i do need to hear how others, and you especially have come to grips and have learned to work through yall's situations. being a small town, groups are coming and going and never seem to last long. as for a regular counselor, i can't get indigent health in my county to pay for that. it helps me so much to be reminded of the inner power we have over our lives and our situations. my worst problem is forgetting many of the things you mentioned. i can just feel what you felt with the friend you mentioned. i have been in similar situations, and always i would wind up apologizing for something that was not my fault to begin with. now thats sick.
    you are a wonderful person to take time to help others, digit. thanks so much...i keep telling myself that change is good...thats what they said in rehab, anyway!!!!

    luv,

    ron

    I am sorry your place is so small that the meetings dwindle. That's very upsetting news to me. Take heart, though. When my home group became exceptionally ill [by following none of the Traditions wholeheartedly] I still stayed sober and serene and was able to fellowship with other recoverings by visiting the Sober Recovery forums.

    I used to moderate the A.A. forum :) but then life happened and I went back to my home group determined to make it well. Ask me how well that worked? No. Don't. [For the record, I have learned that to get a sick AA group healthy again, it takes *more than one person* in the face of 50 or so regulars to want to call a Group Conscious/Moral Inventory. But also for the record, this is when I learned that people in A.A. are not all drug-free. :)] For a happier record, I finally understood in the Big Book where it says that "[God] will show you how to create the fellowship you crave." [pg. 164]

    And then of course, there are the Codependent resources I have discussed before - and discuss on my website .

    Ron, it just occurs to me...my spirit is wailing inside to say this... YOU particularly may benefit from examples of how to DEAL with these controlling spirits. If this is so...Try this 7 part series I wrote not very long ago: Words can Harm. Words can Heal. I wrote it coming from the perspective of the ones who are being harmed and how we can better equip ourselves. Deals with sarcasm as a separate entity, manipulation via shaming and blaming techniques, name-calling and labels, and even gossip :) The sections really delve into how to handle and deal when its been thrust upon you and so hopefully will give you some tools for your toolkit! [Because if you're like me, you understood the problem, you even knew you wanted to heal, but you needed some concrete alternatives? If so, friend, here they are. I teach in this series, the same way I was taught and what my own recovery, experience, and research has taught me!]

    I hope it can help!

    Smile!
    Or don't.
    But be serene either way! :)

    {"commentId":1736390,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
    • 3 votes
    #10.1 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:33 AM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1737130,"authorDomain":"ronco104"}

    wow, thank you digits. i have never had anyone really go through the trouble to show me and teach how to help myself as much as you have. i promise i will check out your work, now....
    if there is ever anything i can do, just let me know. i have always been a fairly good listener. the last semester of college i had, i changed my major to social work to eventually help other alcohlics.....someday!!!!
    anyway, thank you, and if i can ever return the favor...

    luv,

    ron

    {"commentId":1737130,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"ronco104"}
    • 2 votes
    Reply#11 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 1:58 PM EDT
    {"commentId":1738732,"authorDomain":"digits"}

    If you really want to do something for me Ron...listen to Fugitive's motto and take it to heart "Courage is fear that's said its prayers" and then, with that 7 part series in your memory - your recovery toolkit - along with notecards if you need to, start practicing in small ways...baby steps... on how to develop your voice. It may be scary, yes. Change is scary to start with. Learning to set boundaries is even scarier for people like us. But nothing changes if nothing changes and these people....in my experience, they NEVER go away until we turn into the sort of people who *manifest* them away so to speak.

    We need you in this world, Ron. You're a sensitive, kind, valuable and creative person and we NEED you on *our* side and we need you on our team. :) This means we need you strong, happy, whole, healthy, and serene.

    And that's what you can do for me.

    Nothing too major. ;)

    Love, Digits

    {"commentId":1738732,"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512","authorDomain":"digits"}
      #11.1 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 4:12 AM EDT
      Reply
      {"canLink":false,"threadId":"252197","isPrivate":false}
      Leave a Comment:
      You're in Easy Mode. If you prefer, you can use XHTML Mode instead.
      As a new user, you may notice a few temporary content restrictions. Click here for more info.
      {"threadId":"252197","contentId":"1438512"}
      Start TrackingStart Tracking
      Stop TrackingStop Tracking